| Source | https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=uPvd91LCXzw |
|---|---|
| Readwise URL | https://read.readwise.io/read/01kv42nfcpf2tdrjr728kh4dwj |
| Readwise ID | 01kv42nfcpf2tdrjr728kh4dwj |
| Date | 2024-05-03 |
| Author | App Masters |
| Category | video |
| Cover image | https://i.ytimg.com/vi/uPvd91LCXzw/sddefault.jpg?v=671b9526 |
What is up App Nation? It’s your boy Steve P. Young, founder of appmasters.com, the place you go when you want action-packed content related to app helping you grow your app downloads and
your revenues. And today I’ve got a phenomenal guest. He’s an indie app developer that’s going to reveal it all. Like literally, he’s going to pull up his revenue cap. We already saw his screen, revenue cap, super wall, all the data behind the effectiveness, excuse me, of his campaigns. He’s going to show you how he’s been able to profitably run TikTok ads as a bootstrap entrepreneur to get his first initial 500 users. So, without further ado, let me bring in the guest. His name is, and
what is up with my voice? Scott Flary. All right. Let’s just walk How are you, Scott? Welcome to the show, my friend. I’m good, man. I love that intro, by the way. Yeah. Well, I tried to do it. Hey, you’re a special guy, all right?
You see. All right. For those who are just listening to the podcast, Scott Flary, he’s the founder of Parrot Pal, an app that uses AI to help users track their calorie and protein intake with voice notes and text messages, and you can check it out, parrotpal.com, or search for Parrot Pal on your favorite app stores. All right, Scott. Well, I’ll follow your lead, my friend. Thank you so much for coming on doing this. No problem. Are you hitting us with any dad jokes or no? Not not yet, man. We can’t give them the best part yet, this early. You know what
I mean? We got to make them wait. And I saw share my screen now, so everyone has some context on the journey I’ve been through so far, and I think it’s relevant because All right, while you do that. What’s up, Ori? I see all your questions, bro. We’ll get to it. And then Daniel, what’s up, bro? Roman Roman is here. Ori, and then I already said Ori. What’s up, Louise? Ready for this one? Yeah, it’s going to be a doozy, man. All right, here we go. My screen, you see it? Yeah, getting your first 500 users with
TikTok ads, possibly with a small budget. And when I mean small, I mean $20, $30 a day. I’m not talking big bucks. Okay, so we’re small bucks. So, here’s the agenda today, guys. I’m going to give you a brief history of my business journey so far, so it makes sense, and then how I built my first app with insight into influencers. Um then the mistakes I made. Then finding Steve. And then using tactics. Um but I met Steve online, obviously, through this, and um my second app used
all of the goodness Steve taught. Straight away. So, then I showed growth in that app, and I went back to the first app, and that’s growing again. Okay, so that’s the agenda today. So, a brief history. My first website uh my first company in 2015 is a rugby clothing brand, e-commerce background, okay? So, email marketing, Facebook advertising, uh upsells, cross-sells, um Facebook organic and commission, right? And then I co-founded a wellness company called Total Method in 2018 with two big
influencers, like 1.6 million followers. Um which turned into like a full stacks uh health and fitness service, which it wasn’t an app-based business at this point. It was like physical products, nutrition plans, training plans, and we brought in a lot of experts, okay? Um and then I founded ParaPact October 2023. Each business helped the next one, okay? But here’s kind of the firepower that I’m talking about to the method has and why it’s relevant to the Tik Tok strategy later. It’s got a verified Instagram page, nearly 100,000 followers. My other co-founder, 240,000
followers. And my other founder co-founder, 1.4 million followers. And I find the Tik Tok ads I’m doing are more effective than these. Okay? So, that’s why they’re super effective and actually it’s better for us as indie founders. We don’t actually need to rely on this type of firepower. Um Rugby Warfare has here 46,000 followers. And then Para Pal is obviously just getting off the mark, but you don’t actually need the followers to get traction going. Okay? So, the birth of my Scott, we can those those following with
those These are Instagram following, yeah? This is Instagram, yeah. So, Okay. most of the ads I was running through Instagram and Facebook. So, we utilizing the social proof of these influencers, you know? So, they see an ad, they’re like, “Oh, that’s from Louise or Ryan with the blue tick and hundreds thousands of million followers.” It used to work good. It used to be like it used to make ads better than the brand-based ads. Does that make sense? Yes, absolutely. I’m used to make ads more effective, but that’s gone down over the years. And
that’s why this kind of new effective strategy is better. So, again, yeah, just social proof here. So, when when we first had the first app, users had to use MyFitnessPal, Google Sheets, email. They had to change They had to email us. We had to reply in 2 days. We did this for 35,000 people times 12 weeks. We had a lot of data. In 2021, our customer said, “Can you put all of this into one app?” And we were like, “I don’t know. It’s a bit bit much, but we’ll try.” But what could we do if we remove remove the human
element? So, no more limitations in the weekly check-ins. So, we built this AI machine learning algorithm in 2021 for Total Method. But then we tried to grow it and we didn’t know anything. I didn’t know anything. This is the first dip into app marketing from web-based marketing and it’s very different. Okay, so we turned the app from these these apps to this app, okay? Um and it’s an amazing app. But here’s what happened. We spent half a million dollars on development before actually even
looking at app-based growth strategies. I was still trying to use web-based strategies, which just wasn’t working. And as you can see from here, in 2021, we had a huge spike from the influencer push. Um and then we had another spike from more influencers, but we just couldn’t keep traction. We didn’t have even these no SDKs installed. We didn’t know why people were churning. We didn’t have uh any visibility, so we just kept losing users over time even as influencers were pushing the the the app. Okay, so I was like, "What’s going on
here? Like, how is it going backwards when the app is so amazing?" Cuz we get reviews like this. This is the review. There’s 200 of them. They’re all similar to this. It’s amazing. The 14-day masterclass is what we call the 14-day trial. Um it’s helped loads of people and people rave about it, but I didn’t understand why we couldn’t keep going traction. So, here’s the mistakes we made in the first app and then I’ll go into what we did with Steve Steve’s advice. So, we didn’t focus on Apple or Google in-app purchase. Why? Because we tried to grow
through Stripe to save money from App Store commission and it’s a nightmare because we had to then actually handle the subscriptions ourselves and get Stripe chargebacks when people forgot about a charge. 25 quid per go. We did 14-day trials with no card. So, we had a big influencer push. Once we had an influencer um push, we got 80,000 emails and only 800 of them did the trial and then 300 of them converted, but loads of them were left out because we didn’t have that card payment authentication as
well. We had no onboarding. We had no paywall. I don’t even remember where the paywall was. We had to put a paywall up for Apple to pass our app cuz they didn’t like it that we did Stripe. Does that make sense? It was Stripe only and they were like, “No, no, you’ve got to use Apple in-app payments.” So, we put something in the app. Um and we were running ads with one links through AppsFlyer, haven’t they? So, we weren’t actually doing direct install campaigns cuz we didn’t have an SDK set up for Facebook ads. Um and we didn’t just really set anything up and then we were using web
strategies. So, in 2023, AI revolution comes into being and thinking about how to use it for Turtle, but I have an aha moment on how to better track, okay? So, then I built Parapa MVP. So, the domain expertise over the years, new tech, winner. And luckily, Steve, I was walking through London on a sunny day and I come across your podcast and it just started making sense. You’re talking about onboarding and paywalls and hard paywalls. I was like, “What is he on about?” And I started looking into more videos, looking at your presentations and I was like, "Right, if
I’m going to build this now, I build this with these techniques straight away, okay?" And that’s what I did with Parapa. So, this is what I implemented, thanks to Steve. The worked that I didn’t use a Turtle method. So, I implemented a hard paywall. I did Apple only to start with cuz most revenues there, right? No more financial stress on like Android development. I did a proper onboarding. I was testing paywalls, moving paywalls earlier to later and you would mention earlier is better and I’ve got the stats to prove it. Push notifications with One
Signal. I used RevenueCat and Superwall. I found Superwall on one of your presentations, Steve. You said Superwall on the bottom right. I was like, “What is that?” So, I looked it up and I was like, “This is amazing.” Um and I understood how to connect and I actually installed SDKs. Sorry if I’m speaking quick, but I want to get through this part. Um so, here’s the results of Parapa so far. So, we started in October, active subscriptions going up. It’s flatlined the last 2 months cuz we’ve signed an agreement with a app publisher who are going to take over our ads, which
started this week, actually. So, the retention’s great since we turned the ads off, anyway. But here’s a nice consistent growth from getting 500 subscribers using only TikTok advertising. And here’s what happened to Total Method. Like I showed you in this one here, you can see the spike at the start and then it’s dying. Look at the difference at the end of that graph now thanks to implementing your strategies with the paywall, revenue cap, um all that type of stuff. You can see it’s now starting to gain traction and grow again.
Um so Total Method really is gaining from what we’ve learned with ParaPal. So I want to share my screen now for both apps in terms of revenue cap. Um so let’s have a look here. You can see the screen? Yep. Yep. Okay, so as you can see this is ParaPal. This is This is the subscrip- subscribers. We can look at churn rate. We can see the churn rate is also dropping over the months as well, which is great. We get visibility into this. Um we’ve got conversion to paying as well. So people think TikTok ads are low quality. No,
they’re not. You know, if you look at revenue caps, um yearly you can compare with conversion to paying. If you’re over 3 or 4%, you’re smashing it. And look, we’re we’re always above 3 and 1/2%. More so at 5% conversion to paying. And this is from TikTok traffic. So Scott, I’m going to hold it right here. Hold on one second. I just For those who aren’t familiar, this is install to pay, okay? That’s why it’s 3 to 5%. This is a complete install to actual paying customer here, too. Okay. Yes, exactly. Yeah.
Um you can see uh trial conversion here at the bottom and I’ll show this as well. So trial conversion, obviously a health and fitness in January and Feb is better, but this is nearly finished. So we’re looking at 20 to 30% trial conversion, which is decent. We can improve it, of course, but it’s there. We got the stats this time like I didn’t have before. Start rate could be improved as well. But yeah, here’s where we’re at and we’re quite consistent with our from TikTok. So maybe Facebook will be better, who knows. Um
and if we look at our active trials, you can see that we get a spike when the TikTok ads go live and then they back down again. So, we still like organic gain from TikTok ads as well. Like people finding it, searching it. So, you’re still getting something but not as much. And yeah, so we got and then we got realized lifetime value. So, this is an important one. I tried weekly pricing here, Steve, and it comes down. And with this is yearly, so 70% of our subscribers are yearly members.
But we tried weekly a cheap weekly pricing and Superwall’s conversion rate went up to 35 45%. You know, much higher from 25% but obviously lifetime value came down. Maybe they were cancelled, I don’t know. So, there’s a dip there. We’re back to now doing yearly. So, yeah, these are like the basic metrics from Power Poll. Let me just show you now as well Total Method because it’s important that we see the strategies that you’ve mentioned have. So, you can see the spike here.
You can see active trials for Total Method is up as well. This is all from TikTok. So, we’ve got currently we’ve got 538 active trials. Active subscribers are growing. This is Apple only, remember. And we have like four x from January. So, we only started this stuff in January. Year-to-date and we’ve only been spending a small amount of money, like 20 30 40 bucks a day. So, as you can see we’re growing really nicely. And then MRR is well as growing. All of
it is growing in the in the right direction. And then lifetime value as well. Let me get that up. Paying customer. Just want to show That’s something that I have to do later. Monthly. So, we’re doing two You’re open with this, Scott. Like most you know, I’m even afraid of sharing too much but you’re sharing it all. I don’t care about it. We can get it out there. Yeah, we’re we’re doing we’re doing monthly only at the and here’s why. Let me show you some experiments we run. So RevenueCat are
brilliant now you can do paywall experiments and you can really see the nitty-gritty and I’m not a guys I’m not at the best marketing in the world. I don’t know this stuff inside out but I know enough to to make use of it. So here’s the first test I did. We did annual only to start with, okay? So this is the control annual and then the treatment was monthly only, okay? So if we look at the treatment which is monthly only, the realized let me this is more important I
would say. Realized revenue is more on the monthly than annual because they subscribe again, you know what I mean? So you do one month and they pay you again. Yeah. But if we look at the numbers here, let’s have a look. So annual initial conversion rate is 16% the trial start rate but monthly you’re getting more 20.96%. Trial started you got more monthly, you’ve got more complete completions and
you got more conversions. So the monthly converts to 23.8% but the annual only converts to 6.98%. So obviously monthly is going to get me more customers and if you look at conversion to pay in monthly is way ahead of annual here like nearly five times the amount, right? So for me obviously it’s making us more total revenue as well cuz the argument is annual might be better because it brings you in more revenue now but actually after the month monthly is already smashing annual. So it’s like okay, monthly is better
than annual for us no doubt. Then I did another experiment and I thought maybe annual at 96 is too high but why don’t I do six monthly at 39.99. So it’s less but it’s still nearly the same. Does that make sense? Over over the year. I love it. Okay, so let’s have a look. So this is monthly um, versus six monthly. So in terms of total revenue, six-monthly’s winning so far, but as you can see here with the renewal for the month, the monthly’s gaining. So, I
think in like two or three months, we might see monthly overtake six-monthly, but again, they might be very close. So, there’s a difference there. Let’s have a look at what six-monthly does versus um, annual. So, we got 13.6% now instead of What was annual? 5% or something? 10% 6%? So, yeah, 6%. So, annual is 6% conversion trial conversion to pay in. Six-monthly is 13 and monthly is 24%,
right? So, conversion to pay in is higher on the six-monthly, but six-monthly for me, if I want more money now, I’d be better off doing six-monthly because it’s giving me more revenue right now. Does that make sense? Yeah. So, Scott, you’re only testing one price at a time, right? So, you’re only showing a six-month or you’re only showing a monthly or you’re only showing a yearly, right? You never tested having all three available. No, I haven’t tested that, no. Okay. That’d be interesting too to see.
It’s It’s It’s quite good in a way cuz I don’t I think it would revenue paywall revenue can’t paywalls suck up in terms of customize customizing them compared to Superwall. But yeah, But I would test too. What we have data on for another fitness app is like 1312 tends to be the best. Now, he’s always had three. He’s never just had one like you, but I we are testing this with another fitness app. He has They do have a monthly and yearly option and they’re seeing more on the monthly side of things and this is a really big app, but
it could be because the yearly is like 180 or 160. So, it could be a high yearly price that’s causing it, but I the next test we’re going to run with them is a 1312 cuz I noticed that 1312, you know, that Superwall slide that I might you might be alluding to. We did see that one two plans convert better than one and then three plans convert better than two. So it would be interesting to see how your one plan with the monthly that might be winning converts when you have all three one, six, and 12 available for users to choose.
For sure. For sure. And like you know, the paywall is so basic as well. Look at Look at how basic this paywall is. Like it’s pathetic really. You know, like you know, you do the question and what you want to see I mean just cuz I’m in basic like so it does the job. It does the job and that’s my my mantra with all this stuff. Um so let me go back now to So we have that okay. So let me show you Superwall. So Amazing. Uh here’s Paywall. There’s two apps guys but doesn’t matter really.
Uh 24.89% conversion rate is kind of improved sometimes like maybe last 24 hours I don’t know what it is. Uh 25% So we typically Trial start. Trial conversions. Trial conversions 30% gotcha. Gotcha. My bad. Yep. 30% conversion rate from this paywall. The By the way, this paywall I’ve tested it out. It’s the ugliest paywall you’ll ever see but uh it just not nothing beats it like so look look how ugly this is. It’s not even the same color as the app branding.
Um and it’s just this. It’s just basic. Ready to start the revolution. Click start my trial below. Now let me show you some other paywalls I’ve tested just to show you like that I’m not lying. I’ve I’ve tried this Steve this different pricing. You see? I believe you, bro. Yeah. Try this. I’ve tried this like today this happens day seven this happened. I’ve tried like a video and like your weight loss plan is ready. I’ve tried like this type of one. So Superwall is great cuz you can just copy the
templates. Um this one one week on us I’ve tried that. I’ve tried like I’ve done timers. Um I’ve tried load this three one here. Uh I’ve tried a lot I’ve tried a lot of them and basically this ugly one here is the best and I don’t know what to do with it. Dude, that’s what I’ve seen, too. I’m like, what, really? And then I’m like, okay, I believe you. You know what I mean? It it it’s kind of like that. It’s crazy. It is It is like that. It is like that.
So, yeah, that’s that’s what we’re at with um kind of the stats, guys. The proof is there for you to see about the stats. Now, let me get into what you’ve actually all come to see, which is probably the TikTok ads. Um it’s just um strategy, sorry. So, here’s the strategy I’ve been using. Um you post videos on your own TikTok with good hooks and you can Google these hooks like, imagine this, imagine this, or don’t do this. And I’ll show you one hook that I used that got me a lot of downloads. Um I think make sure it’s you. If you’re
a founder of the app, you’ve got the fire inside you to actually talk about the app in a good, passionate way. You can see when people are fake and just reading from a script. I don’t know if it works. So, once the video’s live on your organic Instagram, you do something called a spark ad. And this is good because any page can give you an ad from their organic videos and I’ll show you how to do it and I’ll actually walk through it, but let me just show you some of the TikToks. Okay. Um hold on. Let me bring it back up. I’ve got
the audio. Hold on. This is my This is the app. This is Let me just show you. All right. Watch now. Yeah, we can’t hear the sound, but it’s okay. How the app works. Hold on. Let me watch now. That’s it, huh? That’s simple. Oh, no, you’re just showing us the how the app works first. Yeah, I’ll I’ll show you how it
Got it. Okay, so it’s like a voice logo. And I know it’s important cuz it’s got a virality um way of it on ads, right? But anyway, I wanted to show you the app so you understand what’s going on. So, let’s have a look at what best TikToks are. Okay, so we look Can you see this dashboard here, Steve? Hello. My bad. I was on mute. Yes, we can see it. Yes, sorry. Um so, they the reason I showed you that
video is cuz these videos here, the reaction videos, I record people um tracking their um usage of the app. I ask them what log your food with voice note and then I record the reactions. As you can see from this, we’re getting like 50 cent downloads and installs, okay? So, reaction video 42 cent, we got 209 downloads, 35 cent an install, that was 259 downloads. So, I’ll show you some of these videos now. So, these reaction videos look like I’ll just show you one
of these. Looks like this one. Um It’s very low-key. Today, I’m going to have six eggs. Probably Okay, he just records and then he has a reaction. You know, quite funny. It’s quite mind-blowing. Just like that. And I’m just posting posting these reaction videos and they they bring in ads, right? Um but you can’t hear the video, Steve, can you? No, I can. I could I could hear it. Okay, he said “Today I’m going to have six eggs.”
Yeah, yeah. So, these videos work well, but let me just show you the stats. So, I’ve got a list here, okay? So, to make it easier for you all to see. So, we’ve got the reaction videos, the funny videos, they get cheap downloads, but then I’ve actually figured out how many trials am I getting for these ads and what’s the cost per trial, okay? So, the reaction videos I’m getting $2.7 per trial. Nice. Other reaction videos $3.9 per trial. Funny voices like one of the one I did $5 a trial.
Influencer video, Luke, I’ll show you that, $5.1 but then the main ads I’ve had that went viral like actually getting more expensive now because I’ve been running them since October and I’ve stopped them now. But if we look at the conversion rate is average 25%. It’s costing me $11 a purchase here, 15, 20, 20, 24, 21, 29. So average cost of acquiring a customer is $20, but my most of my buyers were yearly buyers at 49, right? So off the bat when these were cheaper, I
was making these are profitable. I’ve made more money than I spent um on that. So let me show you some of these Let me show you that ad now, which is it got 3.5 million. Here we go. 3.5 million views from the ads. Okay, let’s have a look. Oh, I like that hook. So just for those who are listening, it says my the the the caption says, “My Fitness Pal is dead once people know about this app.” Great hook. Yeah. I don’t know if it’s working.
It’s not working. I’m sure we’ll hear it. Yeah, you know, just like how many comments this ad you know, and I got a lot of abuse as well. You know, cuz you had the MyFitnessPal diehards coming in being like Yeah. No. Yeah, they hate today. But it got so many downloads so I kept I kept running it. I didn’t care. You posted as an organic and then use it as spark. As spark ad. Exactly. It went kind of viral organically. Amazing. And then I run a spark ad. I do that for
most of these things. That’s my strategy. I run it as an organic and then um I then will essentially push them all. It’s not going Look at this load. I do have a couple of It will It will It will It will load now. Um let’s have a look, yeah. So the the purpose of these ads is just use yourself. You don’t have to Look, "MyFitnessPal is dead once people realize it could to this easy to track your calories and protein and be put into a deficit based on your actual
stats. Check this out. Look how nuts this app is. If you want to lose weight and you want to stop, okay? I’m just going to do a video demo. Like always video demo and what I’m doing, what I’ve got. This is the old food I’ve got as well. And you know, you’ve got comments, you’ve got people who loves it, but then you’ve got a lot of feedback you get as well. Like, um is it you know, is it British food database? Does it tell you the carbs? You know, you get a lot of like insight into your app and you get a lot of haters obviously, but you know, you you get so much from running ads. Not just
you get cheap downloads and trials, but you get in humans actually commenting because but I run that ad first. Scott, does getting comments help with the algorithms? Like does it perform better as a spark ad with all 100%. The it did have 800 and something comments. But um I had to delete some because there was just a lot of abuse. I was like, I’ll delete some of these. Um At one point, Steve, my phone was going crazy. Like I was going on here and I was like, you know, I had like 50
comments, 50 comments, 50 comments. And I was like, oh, maybe I should turn it off cuz people are hating it. But I was looking at downloads and I was like, new downloads, new trials, new new customers. Um So, that’s one of the main ones I run. But you can see, I’m just run I’m just doing the same type of ad over and over and over and over. Like I don’t care how I look in these ads. I’m kind of just hooking them in and then I’m giving them Let me show you one more here. Um another one there, similar one, MyFitnessPal’s dead.
I don’t know if they come after me for it, but who knows. Um Yeah, this calorie tracking app is insane. You know, I just run these different types of things. Reply to comments is a good one. You know, Oh, yeah, it’s totally accurate. And they’re like, oh, how’s it accurate using AI? And like, oh, let me explain that then. And then you got people You know, these are reply to comments are really really good and you can run them as ads as well. Um, again, I’m tracking my Christmas dinner here. I’m just doing all sorts of like
stuff that comes into as an idea to be honest. Um, this is on my personal TikTok. I do have a Power Poll TikTok which interestingly these numbers tend to go more viral not viral but they get more organic views than my personal. Um, and I just run these as Spark Ads as well. Um, Scott, what’s what performs couple of questions. What performs better running on Power Poll or running on your own personal as Spark Ads? Yeah, I have the data. I think Power Poll does slightly better
but let me let me check here UK. Where was I running these through? I think these were run through Power Poll. Just so you guys know what Scott’s showing is that $0.50 per install was through for the US as well. So you’re targeting US and UK looks like. Mainly uh, mainly US UK. Um, so yeah, very, very cheap um, because of the virality of it anyway because it’s very engaging. I think TikTok does um, does like it. But like
for example now my Turtle app here, look this is $20 a day this app. You see it Ryan this one here. Let me look at this one. Look. This ad is similar in nature. I I ditched my fitness pal and I now use this app. My fitness pal is just a tracker too. It goes no further than that. It’s a help you lose weight. It’s a help you burn more. Have a This app is a tracking tool that does all the things that my fitness pal does well plus it coaches you and it makes necessary changes based on the data that
you put in the app. So if you want to try it out too That ad love it? It’s a great video. Here, can I break that down real quick? Here’s why I love it. The it’s so simple. He’s just talking but as a viewer he’s moving and so he’s constantly moving around. Like if you watch any video, there’s always going to be cuts all the time. There’s like, you know, they’ll hang on a scene for a couple of seconds. And I love that he’s talking and moving at the same time, too. So, I think that’s a great video. You got me inspired, bro. Like I want to I got to
create some of these Yeah. Right. And then I’m you know what I mean? And then like look, this is $1.6 a download, which still is cheap, right? And like again, it’s profitable. We’re growing with this app. It’s just one app running right now. You know, I’m not running like again, I’m not doing like creative testing campaigns and then like more complicated like acquiring I’m just running app install campaigns, like What What MMP are you using to track the installs? I’m actually These were on AppsFlyer, but now it’s a direct SDK with TikTok.
Oh, cool. Yeah. Yeah. I was using AppsFlyer, but it’s costing me money per Yeah, yeah. I was like, I don’t don’t really want to keep paying that. Yeah. I like how you did it, Scott. You’re like, I’m not doing anything else but TikTok ads, right? now. So, I can sort of prove out that this is working because the installs, the revenues is happening. I’m not doing anything besides I did the same thing with my app. We just did Apple Search Ads Basic. And I was like, “Dude, I didn’t do anything else besides that. I can see that it’s performing well.” So, that’s another way to like quickly test your
data. It’s just don’t run anything else. Especially as an indie like you you’re bootstrapped. So, like you’re going to just focus on one channel first and then see what the data says. So, you don’t have to worry about MMPs and all that attribution all that stuff. Exactly. Exactly. And like it it makes no difference whether it’s like in in For example, if I run an ad in the UK with Louise, she doesn’t perform better than an ad I would say like for like. It doesn’t really matter. You don’t actually know what’s going to work the best. So, you don’t need to pay for influencers or marketing agencies to
give you all this nonsense about like, “Yeah, we’ll get the best creator to match your product.” Blah, blah, blah. Just hook in and then, you know, you’re demo it if you got a demo type of product then perfect, right? Um Yeah, question for you. On your personal Tik Tok, do you post anything other than Parrot Pal? Like was it okay melding both together? I I don’t really post anything other than business-related stuff about Parrot Pal challenges. Yeah, I just go on. I just post about Parrot Pal.
I’ve got some questions for you. Ready for that, man? Or you got more stuff you want to cover? No, go on. Go on. Go on. Okay. I’m just proving to you guys, by the way, I spent 12,000 dollars and I got to log in. Yeah, you go on. Do the questions. I’ll just log in and then you can I won’t share that yet. Okay. Tell me when you want me to share cuz right now it’s just you and me. Scott, Yash says, “What’s up, Yash?” from our team. Can you share your process behind coming up with the right hooks? Yeah, Google. Googled it. Um genuine, just Googled hooks ideas and then whatever one stood
out to me, um I basically went with. So, for example, MyFitnessPal is dead was a hook idea that came from the book um positioning. So, there’s a There’s a book called positioning that says they’re going to compare you to the market leader anyway, so you might as well jump the gun, which causes controversy. But, I was like, “All my hooks are going to be MyFitnessPal related or Slimming World related or Weight Watchers related.” So, MyFitnessPal is dead. If you’ve done Weight Watchers in the last year, um
have you done Slimming World over and over and over? Just like off the cuff. I’m just like ba ba ba ba. Um but there is good sites. No, I show I’ll show you this one. I I did the same thing. I wrote it back in 2014. Hey Apple, I just fixed your camera app. And I kind of broke down the entire thing. Oops, my bad. I’m sharing the wrong screen. Here you go. I was launching a brand new app. This doesn’t exist anymore, but it was like gesture-based camera. So, you can just like shake your phone and it’ll like flip to a selfie mode and all that stuff. And then I’m like, "There’s no
need for a button." And then I was like, "Your photo, you know, this is what I felt like was the key. Your flip Everybody’s taking selfies and like yet the selfie and the thumb is so far when you should keep it the same and they have since changed it. So I tried to really break down and tell them why and dude, I got this one viral and I got like 100 emails and it’s like if you like a pre-release version to test my claims, just email me and people did. Yeah, and I was like, oh shoot, now I had to like literally export all the emails.
Yeah. Yeah, it doesn’t work. It does. Actually, yes. I think just you know, as a founder of the app, if you’re an indie developer, you know your app inside out. Like why did you even build it to start with? You know, you’ve got something there to say about it. Um a pain point that you want to feed, right? Um Ori is mentioning there setting up tracking. I tried Google Ads and I didn’t know how to do it. So I just Tik Tok was so easy to do. Yeah, yeah. Ori says, "Scott, did you set up conversion tracking for your
apps? I’ve been trying to set it up for Google Ads, but having trouble figuring it out. Is it different for Tik Tok?" Mhm. Tik Tok’s easy. Easy as hell. Tik Tok and Facebook are similar. Tik Tok I find easier to run than Facebook Ads now as well. Um I’ve I haven’t tried Facebook yet. Because I didn’t set it up. Um I couldn’t I couldn’t find a way to set it up and now I’ve figured it out, but I got a company that’s going to take over anyway. Um Tik Tok possible Tik Tok ban on the horizon, yeah. Probably. So I can
I can jump into Scott and since you’re so honest, um maybe I’ll try to show off. But Ori, what Man, as I I’ve gotten older, this this phlegm is getting na- nasty. All right. Sorry to gross you guys out. But So Ori, what you can do is you can create a custom product page for Google Ads. So there’s a couple of ways you can run it. If you’re going to run Google UAC, you need Firebase. All right, you need just Firebase integration and that is good enough. And then you can see app refer and web refer are going to be Google based. Again, like what Scott said, just
run Google Ads at once and then let the just without anything else, and let the data decide. Because that data is never going to be accurate whether you have an MMP or anything else, right? Sometimes we looked at it for different MMPs, Facebook says something, MMP says something different, App Store Connect says something different. So, we run into that. So, just because you have an MMP doesn’t fix everything. Might even cause more issues. So, Firebase for Google UAC. Now, Google Ads now allow you to do PPC campaigns. So, like keyword, SEM
campaigns, search engine marketing campaigns, with the landing page being your App Store link. So, before you couldn’t do that. Every time you put your landing page in a as an App Store link, it would say run a Google UAC. Now, you can. So, you can bid and we are running this for our app right now. What we did was for that tracking, we created a custom product page, and that became the landing page for Google SEM. Now, I don’t know by keyword what’s converting the best, but I can kind of guess. And
so, for our data, we found that one of these keywords was driving most of the cost, but when I looked at the conversion data, it wasn’t converting very well. So, we’re now creating a brand new CPP just for that particular keyword. But you you can use the custom product page, cuz custom product pages you can track downloads and revenues from that custom product page. Yeah. That’s such good advice. I was starting to do that with I was starting to do that with Apple for my like website landing page and stuff as well. So, to see if they did something. Beautiful. Um Can I ask you guys what is considered a
small budget? Scott? For me, the smallest you can do, which is 20 bucks a day on the campaign. Um I have seen people say small budget is like 50 grand a month or something. But um that’s different, you know, like agencies are different, man. Different breed. They got people scaling things to 30 grand a day. Yeah. I’m not I can’t do that. Uh Scott, how did you afford to pay half a million dollars building the app? From our profits, actually. So, we were very, very profitable on the um on our nutrition plans and and we did
challenges. We had like a high-ticket membership. But, people wanted us to build the app, so we were like, “How do we risk it?” Eventually, we did risk it and we put all our money into the app. But, we focused too much on the the features and the design and all that stuff as opposed to the growth of the app because we kind of got We grew really fast over the COVID, by the way. Over COVID, we were doing live workouts and stuff. We made a a lot of profit and then, yeah, we just deployed it there.
It cost that much because it’s actually very complicated. However, the back end of Total Method, we track like 40 different data points. It’s mainly women, their menstrual cycle, stress levels, everything. And we have to have an algorithm that crunches it once a week that then spits out like personalized um information. So, it took us a long time to get it right and the code as well had to be good. So, we used an agency from America, actually, because um we just couldn’t afford to risk going down the hill with
with it. So, we I think the the company’s called Big Binary. They they built um they built um Gumroad. So, I found out about Big Binary because I read a blog post from Gumroad’s owner that said he started using Big Binary because they were 50 bucks an hour and it was like the contract is everything is yours. It’s very simple. You just pay for more hours. And I was like, “That sounds perfect to me. Like, let’s just go with them.” But, I don’t know if that’s expensive compared to maybe someone cheaper.
It’s pretty good. Scott, are you planning to try Reels and YouTube Shorts in the future with the possible TikTok ban on the horizon? Yeah. Yeah. I mean, I I won’t be able to I don’t have to do these ads ever again because I got a an ad publishing business taken over and we split the profits. Um but, I’m happy to share results from that in the in in time to see if they actually get better results than me. At the moment, they’re going to struggle to beat the half a dollar downloads. But, um they’re going to have big budgets, so we’ll see if it
scales essentially. Um But, yeah. I I’ve got to share more things to share as well on how to how to set TikTok ads up if you want, Steve. Yeah, let’s do it. I love it. So, if you can Yeah, if you share my screen So, here’s how you do it. It’s very basic. Um it’s called Spark Ads. So, this is a TikTok video on my profile. I click the three dots on the bottom. I then go to ad settings, and then I get my code. So, this code is then I copy this code,
and then I basically have it something like this. So, let’s do it now. So, I create an ad. I go to advanced. I pick app promotion, app install, dedicated campaign, yes. And then, you pick the app. Um And that’s a whole process, right, Scott? Connecting the app into the TikTok ad campaign? Yeah, oh my god.
On Facebook, I was like, how do I do it? And I was missing one link in the settings that stopped it. But, it it it stops you as well campaign-wise. I’ve got 28 now, but it used to be 14, but I don’t know. So, I just go next now. I don’t really mess about with like too much things. Let’s have a look. This is what genuinely I would do. This is how quick I would do it as well. Um USA Um I would do I don’t do automatic. I just want TikTok. And then, saved audience I got like a USA generic one.
Nice. This is like That’s different age groups and all that stuff. Yeah, groups. And then, I did Does it have um It did It used to have interests, so maybe one of them does. One of them Maybe this one. No, it’s probably They probably got rid of some of the interest or something. I would go this city different states. I like that. Nice. the interest like half the fitness, you know, let TikTok’s amazing algorithm do the work for you. The TikTok put dot
days like I think it’s through No, yeah, it’s what you can do 20 um $20 a day install and I go next. And here’s where you get this code that you got from the app. And you can This code you would ask for an influencer as well. So, if you wanted an influencer to do a post on their feed for you, you then ask them to do the same process and give you the code. So, use TikTok account to deliver Spark Ads. I put that on. Um I don’t know why it’s not saying it go link accounts. Um
It should be it’s post by authorized account. Let’s try that. Ah, yes. Yeah. This is an AI account I created, by the way, cuz you can create AI ads, but it didn’t really work, so um Authorize post. Yeah, and then you just paste that in there. Search for it. Confirm it. And then you got to confirm it again here. If people need to just run through it again if you need to um Yeah, so you There we are. Done. So, this is now the The beauty of this is once the ads bring you views and
comments, if someone organically goes on your profile, they will see a huge amount of views on the video, huge amount of comments, and they might be thinking, “Oh, that video’s gone viral.” But no, you just put money behind it. You know? So, if you look at my my one down here, it’s got 3.5 million views, and it’s not because it went viral 3.5 million, it’s because I put ad spend behind it. Where’s it gone? I don’t know where it’s gone. Um That’s a bear. 3.5 million, you like, “Wow, wow, fair play.” But no, it’s just uh through the ads. And then you just
confirm it, and then boom. That’s it. That’s it. Quite quick, no? That’s it. It’s perfect. Simple. I love simple. So simple, and you can do this video tonight, guys. Don’t mess about. Go and get your video done. Put it on TikTok, run the campaign. You have to get the SDK set up, obviously, but you can use AppsFlyer as well. I was using an Android initially. But that’s how easy it is to get your first few users. Now, here’s some um I did paywall. Okay, let me go on Figma actually to show you.
So, this paywall I did that. You want to I got a going to question. Yeah, yeah, go ahead. is I presume there’s there isn’t a way to maximize conversions then. Anyway, I’ll give it a try. Like Facebook, you can try to maximize for start trial. There’s nothing like that on TikTok that they you’ve tried? I don’t know. As in as in as in pick a different objective, you mean? Yeah. Mhm. I think you can, but I don’t really I haven’t really looked into that too much, to be honest. I just want to be this is the small budget, right? If you
want to do the maximize conversion, all the guys I’ve talked to, $500 daily budget. If you want to try to get Facebook to really kick that in because you need enough installs for the algorithms to pick it all up. And again, the topic was how to run TikTok ads with a very $20 a day type of budget. So, all right. And you’ve got to remember with Facebook, I think you need like 128 of the installs a day or the objective per day. So, like, you know, you are looking at spending
thousands a week. And you don’t even know, you know, that’s why you do some creative testing, they call it. Maybe what I’m doing, they call it creative testing, but I’m not messing about with I don’t care about conversion rate of like I don’t care about impression rate, I don’t care about clicks, I don’t care about none of those metrics. I only care about what’s the cost per install and actually is that ad then getting me a trial. I have noticed that some ads bring me trials, but they’re not the best at converting to uh installs, but not the best at converting to a trial. Okay, so, for example, Australia and Canada I found
were cheap installs, but they didn’t actually start the trials as much as the USA and UK. Um the influencer guy I used, he was getting me good installs, but actually didn’t get me many trials. So, I had to stop those ads, and I could see that data in in AppsFlyer. Um but that’s the only thing I would I would I would look at. Um Yeah, so I want to show you this. So, this is like the I I I tested the paywall just after the questionnaire, as you can see here.
And then, I was like, “What about if after they get their questionnaire, they get a app tour, and it shows them how cool the app is with the voice tracking, and then the paywall?” And then, basically, 90 to 95% of people see the paywall after the questionnaire. But only 65% of people see it if I put it at the end of the app tour. And the problem is, even at the end of the app tour, you could say, “Well, the people that do see that, maybe they convert better.” They didn’t. They weren’t better. Um so, if we look at Figma here, it’s like it’s just very
basic onboarding. It’s like this screen. Yeah? Bam. I don’t know if you can see it. Yeah? Um Start now. Google, Apple, and then it’s just like the the information we need to create a custom plan for them. Um and then, it’s just the loading screen, and then boom, paywall. This is really ugly. Uh so, it doesn’t matter at all, but uh you know, whatever. Um but then, you’re thinking, “Oh, maybe we land on the today page, and you get a tour.” Look, look at this nice app tour.
Ooh, yeah, brilliant. I can see how to use the app. And oh my god, yeah. No, no one cares. Paywall, huge drop off. So, not as effective. I would not recommend um doing that. So, Steve, your advice on this was the same, yeah? Show the paywall earlier, more frequently, be aggressive, hard paywall. Don’t mess about. Yeah. Hard paywall if you’re just trying to get revenues and figure out product market fit. That’s what I would do. I think long-term, maybe soft paywall is the right way, cuz we are seeing
with our app, we were able to take it from one to 1,000 a month with just a like a soft paywall and one-time in-app purchase all the way eight to $10,000 a month with a hard paywall, but with a soft paywall, same onboarding, same paywall layout, but adding that X dropped it in half. But, I think keep an eye on there your app store ratings. If they start faltering, your ASO rankings might start faltering, too. And so, that’s what I noticed with this other app that we were involved with and and then maybe doing a hard paywall was a the wrong strategy. So, keep an eye on
it. If it make certain apps though, Scott, we worked with where a hard paywall is still yielding them like 4.8 ratings. So, it really depends. Just keep an eye on your ratings cuz it might affect your ASO on that end. Yeah, well, the app publishing company I’ve gone with, they’ve said the same like you want to ask for a review for the app like as soon as possible. And he was like, “Don’t ask me why that works, it just does.” And I’m like, “Okay. I haven’t even used the app yet, so why would they rate it a five?” But,
there are people doing people do pay yourself. Um, she’s from Nigeria. Shout out to you, man. I love you. All right. So, anything else you want to share? No, I think I’ve shared I think I’ve shared everything here, paywall wise. I think I’ve shared all the info I want to share. Um, hopefully I know I’ve gone through it fast, but if you want the slide deck to see it more, you can. Um, if anyone wants a free year access to Papapap in exchange for genuine feedback, then please let me know. Um, it is a weight loss focused calorie tracking app. So, if you know, if you don’t have to do losing weight to use it
to try it out, but um, it would be good to get like brutal feedback, which I do like. Um, but yeah, I know I’m I’m willing to share information like this to anyone who wants to chat about it. Um, but yeah. I do want to ask you about the community aspect, but before I do that, we’ll tease that, all right? Oh, yeah. All right, Scott, we’ll tease that, but we’ll do that in the middle of the app audits, but let’s Let’s into the dad jokes.
All right, dude. You want to go first or you want me to go first? Um, I’ll go first. You You go first. I I only know Are you ready? Yep. I only know 25 letters of the alphabet. I don’t know why. why? I love it. I don’t know why. The Scott, we’re we’re playing for a pint, right? Yes. Loser pays for a pint. Okay.
Yes. Well, since you’re you’re from the UK, Scott, why did Adele cross the road? Why did a what? Why did Adele cross the road? Adele? Yeah. I don’t know. To say, “Hello from the other side.” There you go. All right, put I’m going to make you guys do a little bit more work. Put Steve or Scott because we got more? Have we got more? Have we got more? Oh, we’ll do a few more. Yeah, we’ll do three rounds, bro. We’ll do three rounds. Let’s get into the app audit though.
And if you want your app audited in future live stream, just go to appmasters.com/audit appmasters.com/audit. All right, we got Bence or Bense. Mostly on ASO and monetization, getting users, more ratings, all that stuff. And we kind of covered whoops, wrong one. Let me add this one to the stage. So, here is Bence’s app. Anything on the ASO front Scott, you want to talk about? Uh, I’m not an ASO expert to be honest, but I like the screenshots a lot.
I think it’s very clear. Yeah, I like it, too. I think the only thing I would do is just call out the authenticator side. I like the ASO the title. He’s going exact match in the US and with this little this little symbol causes Apple to be like call it a unique very character. So, if you just put authenticator without any symbols afterwards, Apple might say, “Hey, somebody has that app name, {quote} {unquote}.” But, if you put this little symbol, it forces Apple to consider it unique. So, just a
little ASO trick. Good job, Bents, on that one. I like how you’re going exact, but just put authenticator in your first screenshot. We have seen it work well from an ASO perspective and a conversion rate perspective, too. Cuz obviously, if that’s the main keyword, and that’s the main keyword you want to rank for, regurgitate that in your first screenshot so they know, “Hey, that’s what I searched for. Oh, that’s what you do. Great. Perfect.” They see it in your app title. They see it in your screenshots, as well. Okay. Now, ASO-wise, I like it. Let me see if the Spanish Mexico trick is being
used. Okay. Love that. Yep. Looks good on that end. I like it. Not much else. I mean, I’m going to assume you’ve done all the homework because, judging from your ASO right now, Bents, it looks pretty positive that you’ve done the homework in terms of looking at the right keywords to go after. 2FA, MFA, authentication app. So, love all of this, too. Love that you mixed up the different title and MX, too. Let me look at Vietnamese. Yep, love it. This is what I would do right now, Scott. In the
US App Store, now, in UK, and you guys only have UK, I think. It used to be Australia, as well. But, in the US, we have nine different localizations, and I have a different title for every different localization. And so, Bents, you did a good job in having a title in every single different localization and different subtitle, too. So, that’s a great ASO. Not much more I can add to that. I would also test video versus no video. See if which one performs better. If video performs better, keep it, but just test that, too. All right. Sorry, Scott.
Go for it. All right. I think there’s a TikTok video there for him. Um introduce the app and use that video you got there in the screenshots as the demo, and then boom. Yeah. All right. We need one more vote. Right now, it’s tied. Steve, Steve, Scott, Scott. All right. One more vote to break it. It’s a pint, dude. It’s a It’s a big big big reward available. Big names over here. I do love London, though. It’s You guys got some great vegan food. All right. London’s the best. Let’s get into Ben’s
app. I’ve got your app, Scott, if you want to show off anything. So, I like this. Secure all your accounts. All right. Yep, I love this. I love the arrow, too, right here. Down next. Cuz it reminds me to scroll. End-to-end encryption, love it. I think the only thing, Ben, is maybe getting people to interact with your app a little bit more instead of just It’s a lot of next next next. It’s like, "What
are you here for? What are you trying to authenticate? What are you currently using?" You know, just to get you some data cuz I think, Scott, what we’ve seen is when then you track it, you can see, “Oh, these guys want it for email or checking whatever it is.” Then you can highlight that in your marketing materials. Mhm. Yeah, for sure. That’s nice. There you go. Here’s some both. Okay. I like this. See, this is perfect. Maybe this a little bit bigger. Oh,
maybe right before customization. Love it. Paywall, you know, quick recap. Quick recap. All right. That’s not bad. What do you think, Scott? Recap? Don’t know if you need a recap, but I think that’s quite nice. All right. What’s the Is there a Is there a Is there a paywall to this, then? Oh, there we are. Yeah, really. Uh like lifetime looks very appealing. Oh, yeah. Uh I’m not sure what about this free trial
enabled. I don’t know I I speak to I think people are already confused by Apple’s uh thing and they’re going to get annoyed by it. I would like to know to see what Has he got any people complain about that? Oh, no. No, I haven’t. So, I’ve seen apps like this where they’ll do free trial enabled and only one plan has a free trial. So, that’s something you might want to try, Ben. It’s like, okay, free trial enabled means yearly is the only one that gets you the free trial where the monthly is paid up front cuz it looks like I can do
both. Yeah. Oh, this comes with a 3-day trial. And then this is probably a 3-day Oh, yeah, they’re both 3 days. So, they’re both 3 days. So, you might just want to limit the 3 days to one plan. And then here you can you can even do lower plan lower prices for the yearly without the trial if you wanted to try that route, too. But paywall looks pretty good. I don’t I don’t have too much feedback. Anything on your end, Scott, from paywall perspective? I think it looks very good. I like how like big it is, like easy to read.
You know? Yeah. It’s and it looks nice as well. It’s on brand, unlike mine. All right. The let’s close this. See what happens. Okay, I figured there’d be a discount. No subscription limited. Yeah. So, here’s what I do have data on. Having a feature like this, I’ve been talking about long paywalls in the in 2019 working better. And it does routinely work better. The only side that I would eliminate is this feature table because I do like it, but it it
might also signal to me that, “Hey, this is all I need.” Three accounts, right? I don’t care about all these integrations. So, I don’t care about any of this stuff. Three accounts, I might be like, “Cool. I’m good with the free plan. Thank you.” Right? So, rather than play up your paid stuff rather than showing people what they can get away for free. Because if we can get away for free, guess what? We’ll get away with it for free. So. But this looks like it’s a hard paywall. Oh, go without limitations. Continue with reduced Oh, go with limitations.
Mhm. All right. I’d love to know the stats on this app and like the conversion and stuff. Be interesting to have if there’s But Yeah. All right, Ben, just keep us posted and let us know what happens. And then if you want to reveal everything like Scott just did, well that will have a happily have you involved. All right, Scott. So, I’m going to give you the win cuz Nerox just put S. We’re both S’s. Nerox, that’s why I said put Scott or Steve. And then Ori gave us both votes. Steve. All right.
It’s a bad joke. So, you got that first round. You want to go to round two? Yeah. Let’s do it. Um okay. You’re going to go first this round? Sure. Scott, what do kids and farts have in common? Ready? Yeah. We don’t mind our own, but can’t stand others. There you go. Nice.
Okay, you ready for this one? Yes, sir. Have you heard of the new sport called quiet tennis? No. It’s like normal tennis, but without the racket. I like it. All right, put Steve or Scott. All right, Nerox, Steve or Scott. You’re going to have to spell it out. Hey Scott, you ready for the You we I got all these from the Have you seen those dad jokes YouTube guys? Have you seen them? Yeah, yeah. Yeah, they’re so good. Um there’s a guy
on TikTok that like creates like a alien animation of them. Have you ever seen them? It’s amazing, man. It’s amazing. Look it up. I’ll pick that up, man. Hey Scott, I want to talk about the community aspect of it. How to build a community for your users so they are more sticky and part of the journey. I love it. I’ve heard other the founder of Healthy talk about that’s a big selling point for them. Cuz he was like he doesn’t do trials. I heard this on the Sub Club podcast, but he doesn’t do trials. He doesn’t believe in it. I disagree with him on that point, but he did talk about how community was a huge
aspect of his app. You want to talk a little bit more about community in Pear Shaped You? Big time. Uh big time. Uh both Total Transformation and Pear Shaped You have communities. Pear Shaped You has a WhatsApp group and I reply in there quite fast. Um people people are like you know, amazed at some of the replies, uh the speed. I just get so much good feedback from my users in the WhatsApp groups. Um Every day what I do to both apps is every day I I put a podcast out in the morning. It’s 10 minutes long to all my
members and I try and ground them in this like one day at a time philosophy about using the app, taking taking slow steps, don’t be overwhelmed. And that tends to be a very good way of getting into your customers’ minds, 10 minutes a day on a walk. I don’t know if it applies to everyone listening, but I found that one of the most effective methods of communicating really key aspects to my members. Um And from the community you get favors. Um can you guys leave a review? Can you
guys give me a feedback form? Can you do a fill out a a persona form for ads? Where do you come from? Do you like the ad? Um and we do it with my other company, Total Transformation, we do events as well and you see people in real life. It’s amazing. Yeah, it is. You know, how do you get in a community around authentication, for example, might be a question, you know? And you have to go wider than the authentication, you have to do a community of why it who are the people wanting this? Are they tech people and run a general kind of um group of people
and you need to find out who your customer is. Half the fitness is a lot easier because people are looking to lose weight, get fit and healthy. So, building a community to support them on the journey is quite natural. Other businesses might find it harder, but definitely create a WhatsApp group support group for sure. That’s your personal number? Can I Can I join it? Yeah. That’s crazy. I don’t care about you know, let’s get them in. Um The problem with it you can’t see the
past of the of the chart. So if you’re new when you join you don’t see all the past, but I mean some person some guy replied like I can’t believe this customer service level like no way can you scale this. I was like don’t worry about it. We scale it. We scale it. Yeah, I I hate when they people say that. It’s like dude Moment in time, right? It’s It’s all about moment in time. Yeah. We’ll figure it out. Enjoy it. Yeah. Yeah. I want to show off your community and
how you’ve integrated in the app. So I’ve got Parapell. I’m going through it all. All right. All right Scott, we’re we are tied. We’re going to need that third one, but I’m going to let me show it off real quick here. This part of the app here. I want to What’s you showing this? I don’t really in my apps I don’t really believe in like a in a trial without support. So you notice on Turtle and Parapell every day of a trial comes with its own unique podcast. It comes with its own unique message in the chat in the home page.
It comes with its own unique guidance. So they don’t It’s not just a trial. It’s like I’m going to help you use this app and get the right mindset. You can skip the tour at the top right. And that’s all. Yeah, you can end it. Yeah, it’s in the whatever. You got to What are you? Yeah, that’s for the barcode scanner. Okay, so day one you do two small tasks today. One is to listen to the podcast and the second one is to track what you’ve already eaten today no matter if
it’s 10:00 p.m. cuz that’s an important thing. I might download this app at 9:00 p.m. and be like oh [ __ ] Just voice You can even do it now Steve. Voice log what you’ve eaten for food. You know, you you see the microphone icon? Yeah, press and hold it down and just tell us what you’ve had. I’ve had a shaken ice espresso with oat milk. I bought shaken. What is that? Oh, yeah. That’s pretty good.
Yeah. That serves right here. That’s it. That’s all it Yeah, you can do a full day in one go, you know, Sisy. What’s up community? And what’s up? Cheers. Nice. Just that alone, huh? Join the Facebook community, what’s up? Love it, dude. Yeah. I’ll push it more. Um But, yeah. I mean think about how you can make a trial. I don’t call it trials, I call it fat loss masterclass, and I call the total method one nutrition and mindset masterclass.
I find it works better. Do you need 5 is for TikTok ads? I don’t think so. I got 5 is cuz they’re but Yeah, you don’t. Good. Yeah, you need a TikTok SDK, which is what Scott has, or an MMP. So, those two. Cuz it’s hard to set it up within TikTok. That’s a video in itself. Connecting your app to TikTok. That’s very hard, too. I I AppsFlyer AppsFlyer is quite good for it. Quite easy. But, it was a costly for me. But, AppsFlyer was the most of them anyway.
All right, let’s get into Greg’s app audit. Are you in time? You okay? Yeah, yeah. Good, good, good. Okay. So, Greg asks on ASO strategy, can’t get the traction from organic and conversion rate from impression to install is super low. So, I get this question a lot, Scott. Conversion rate from impression to install. Like, it’s too low. What what should I do, Steve? And I’m like don’t do anything. Don’t even pay attention to that number. Now, this is just my this is my opinion. The reason why I don’t pay attention to
it is because I have no idea what an impression means. So, I don’t want to figure out like what how to improve something if I don’t know how an impression is counted for. I do know like for the Google ads I just told you guys about, people are coming to my product page and not downloading. And that is more important to me. So, I can see that the keyword is driving most of the traffic and when they hit the product page, maybe the keyword isn’t matching up to what they’re expecting to see, so they’re dropping off. And that means I have to improve the screenshots.
So, that’s why we’re creating a new custom product page that has that particular keyword in our screenshots. Yeah. Well, I go some of the last week iPhone my my impression to conversion rate is terrible when my ads are off. When my ads are on, it goes up to 30 40%. Now, the reason why maybe because the ads are more targeted and the people coming
through are already sold. But, yeah, I found if you run some ads, you can see those numbers fly up. Yep, I agree, man. Yeah, this is what I’m saying that I don’t pay attention to that because yeah, you can do a lot of things to manipulate the the ranking. All right, so Greg, here’s what I would do from an ASO standpoint. Story templates, I’m going to assume it’s your main keyword because you have it here. What I would try to do is here’s how I like to do ASO. So, this has 212 ratings, which is not that much in comparison to where you’re already at, Greg. So, I’m going to just pick this
one cuz obviously they’re number two for this keyword that you’re not Let me see if you’re anywhere. Vizor Vizor Okay, no, you’re not. So, here, let’s look at this. And let’s just see how competitive this keyword is. So, layout, story, story art, not bad. What was it called again? Story templates. Okay, 33, not bad. IG 15, 13. So, they’re not even that high.
Three templates is not high. Obviously, Instagram story template is probably the best one. So, but I don’t know what who ranks that. And so, now let’s go back to right here. I want to see what other keywords are high. Maybe layout, but we’ll get to that because maybe you don’t have that, but let’s just do this for real quick. Okay. So now again, I’m going to pick that high traffic keyword. I’m going to try
to find an app that doesn’t belong like here again. So leading with that primary keyword, great. Having Instagram in your subtitle for Instagram, great. Now what you can try to do in the MX title, let’s see if you’ve done it. So instead of doing photo eraser and editor, which dude, it’s going to be so freaking hard for you to try to rank for, is just go all in on story templates for Instagram in the title. That’s how I would try to do it. And that way you can try to leverage your instead of keyword that you’re trying to
go for right now. So that’s how I would do ASO. You’re You’re trying to go after two competitive keyword when you don’t have the downloads or the revenues to support it yet. That’s just my assumption based off of 103 ratings. And you asking for a free app audit. That’s just my assumption off of that. So take that with a grain of salt, but yeah, that’s how I would really try to optimize the the keywords here. All right, Scott. You ready for the last round? Yeah? We are round three, bro.
Whoops, wrong button. Damn. Going to a round three, my friend. Okay. You got one more in you? Yeah. You want to go first or you want me to go first? go first, you go. You want to go first? Yeah, I’ll go first. Okay, go for it. What has five toes, but isn’t your foot? What? My foot. I like it. All right. All right, Scott. This might be getting
This might get me in trouble, but why not? What do you call a superhero with no sense of direction? Wonder Woman. All right, but Steve, you thought my JOKE WAS BETTER. YOU HAVE TO GOT YOU HAVE TO PICK STEVE FOR THAT. Good God, that’s a brilliant one. All right, thank you, man. Well, you owe me a pint next time we see each other, whether it’s that’s in London or in the Bay Area. 100%.
Scott, anything else that you want to make sure we cover? Uh no, I think I said, guys. I think I’ve covered it. I’ve covered bases there. I think all I’d want to do is hopefully Steve, you get people just doing some TikToks and running some ads and get in touch with you and see how they’ve gone. Yeah. No, it’s Scott, I really want to thank you for being open, so honest, sharing everything, all the numbers behind all you’re doing. I think Scott is a testament to, “Hey, you don’t need a big budget.” Yes, these big brands, these big agencies that I’ll bring on,
they’re running They’re used to running. So, they’re only used to say doing one thing, so they’re going to tell you to do that one thing versus having somebody like Scott who brings it in, “Hey, this is my money that I’m spending, not somebody else’s money. Literally from my bank account, so I’m going to be more careful with it.” And Scott is a testament to, “Hey, you don’t need a big budget to make things work. Here’s how you do it. It’s going to be slow and methodical, but at the same time it’s going to be effective as well.” If you want to check out Pair Pal, just go to pairpal.com or search for Pair Pal within the iOS App Store as well. Really
great onboarding. Scott, congratulations on the success, man. And thank you so much for sharing all the freaking numbers. That’s why I love this community, man. I mean, I was I was scared for you, Scott. I told you, like, “Are you sure you want to share all this?” But you’re like, “Yeah, [ __ ] it. Let’s do it.” And so, thank you for I’ll pay you in like a year’s time. We’ll We’ll get another one and we’ll be like, “Look at those pathetic numbers last year.” Yeah. Um you know? But I think become your own influencer. You don’t need other The influencer age is dead in regards to the biggies.
You The authentic influencers are in. And got this data from my friends who are influencers. They’re going to be in applause. So, I love it. Okay, Scott, I I have Ori’s answer. If you want to stick around, feel free. Otherwise, thank you so much. And then next week, I’m going to be off and my team’s going to bring you all the insights on Google Ads. I’m going to a camp with my daughter, so I’m not going to be here, but my team will be here. So, don’t worry. If you don’t see me, it’s going to be my team showing you how we do Google Ads for apps and websites as well. All right. Scott,
thank you so much for joining, man. I appreciate you, dude. Let’s stay in touch. I’d love to have you back after you did the publishing deal. Yeah? 100%. Let’s talk in 6 months. All right. That’s all I got. Thank you. All right, Ori, I’m going to answer your questions a little bit. You asked about the App Advice campaign last week. It was a great live, by the way. You talked about App Advice. I want to do it right and maximize the results. So, I have a few questions. All right. For an App Advice campaign, the best way to do it, how long should I offer the app for free? If you’re doing the free lifetime
offer, 2 days. That’s all you need. Should I use new special screenshots when the app is free? Not necessary. Waste of time. Where should I ask for the rating? Right after the paywall? Is it better to show the rating prompt or enter a screen asking for a rating? Just show it. I’m lazy, but it’s up to you. I’m fast. I’d rather go fast. Should I create a paywall showing the special offer or is it better to show all the plans? Just show all the plans. Keep it simple, right? Just like Scott did, keep it simple. So, that’s what I like to do,
as well. Yo, this is Burmese. I can’t read Burmese, but thank you, Nerex. I think this is Burmese. I appreciate you, man. I am Burmese, so thank you. Ori, thank you, Scott. All right. Everything else is good. Cool. Uh ga ya. Is this Nerex, is that in Burmese? Ga ya. I don’t know how to read that. But anyways, here’s how you say goodbye in Burmese. Uh let’s see. Just bye. Well, if you do see me, thank you, Ori. If you do see me, say “Nei ga la.” That means how you doing pretty much. Hi, how
are you in Burmese. Nei ga la. Nei ga la. Okay. Oh, all right Chatter. I’ll go a little bit longer. Why don’t we do this, all right? You guys want to Yeah, I think it means that. Thanks. Oh, okay. Nei ga la. Maybe that what it’s what it is. All right. Uh Chatter says, “Hi Steve, what do you think about AI girlfriend app niche?” I like it. It might be a little late. I did like it maybe 6 months ago. So, you might be a little bit late Chatter, but never too late. Just find the right keywords. You’re do ASO.
I like the niche. Do ASO. And then try to find one. You know, what you’ll find too is Chatter, there are some websites that are AI girlfriend related that don’t have an app. So, you can leverage their brand as well. So, yeah. I like the niche. And so, here’s what I would do. Look, number 12, AI How do they get so high for this pretty good keyword? Number 12. Just click on this. Let’s see if we can find some different keywords that we might be able to do. So, like Poly, I don’t know what that
is, but AI girlfriend, spicy chat, crush on. Right? Roleplay. So, this is how I find new keywords that I might be able to target. Try to find the app that has the least that doesn’t belong in the search results. Do that. All right. Anybody else? Let’s going to go a little bit longer. Maybe we can do that moving forward. I’ll spend the last 5 10 minutes just by myself answering any of your questions. No? Few seconds.
All right. We’re good. All right. Well, good. Guys, thank you so much for joining. I really do appreciate you. Again, my team Alok is going to lead the Google Ads discussion. We’ve been running a lot of Google Ads especially for e-commerce like digital products too from our agency with clients. And then definitely helping clients from a UAC. And we’re testing out a lot for our for our own apps using SEM. I really think it’s a good strategy. Belshar talked about it in a previous live stream. He used that as his primary
growth channel. I’ve had clients who used only Google Ads as their primary growth channel using Google UAC with Firebase. And so, I really want to explore that a little bit more. All right, last question and then we’ll we’ll say goodbye. All right, Be Light says, “What do you think about localization app for more languages like French, Portuguese, Spanish, etc. for Google Play? Should we create long description for every single localization?” Like just you can spend a lot of money and waste a lot of money on this. I would do it, but I would do it one step at a time. So, use data to
Here’s what I always say, use data inform your decisions. If you feel like these French, Portuguese, Spanish, obviously Spanish, a lot of people speak Spanish, are going to be profitable for you, go ahead and start with the title and short description and keep everything in English. If you start seeing more downloads, right? Or it you’re starting to see some signals that it’s working, go ahead and optimize a long description. Cuz it’s really cheap these days with AI to get these translated. But then if the long description, you have so much text to
you don’t want to get it wrong, right? So, with the title and short description, you have less text so you can have AI translate for those languages and then you could have a native Spanish speaker and be careful Spanish is different among Spain, Mexico, Argentina. It’s all different. So, you want to just have a native speaker kind of look through it, make sure it looks good, and then you get to go live. But I’ve had friends if you’re an indie, I’ve had friends like localize everything, the app stores and the actually inside the app itself,
and he didn’t see a positive ROI from that experiment. So, I just do one step at a time. You can do like start with screenshots or title and short description, then move on to long description, and then now you’re starting to see more and more results, and then maybe you need to put support Spanish within your app. That’s how I would do it. Just wait for the signals to come in. All right. Thank you, Ori. I will have a fun camping trip. I’m excited. I mean, it’s overnight. Kind of nervous, too, to be stuck in a bunker with a bunch of boys. But, oh well, here we go.
All right, guys. Next week, it is my team talking about Google Ads, and the week after, I will be back on May 17th to talk all about retention, especially subscription retention and app subscription retention in particular. We’ll talk about retention from a usage perspective, but for me, show me the money. So, monetization retention, as well. We’ve got Jacob, who’s a great guy who talks a lot about He has the retention.blog
blog, and he writes a lot about this. So, we’re going to have him come on and talk all about that. All right. Have a great weekend. I’ll see you guys in 2 weeks. Bye. Should’ve said bye before. Bye again.